On “Dead to Me,” Jen and Judy are best friends forever. Or until the next cliffhanger.
This new “traumedy,” which began streaming last week on Netflix, follows two 40-something women who meet at a grief support group in Southern California and bond almost immediately. (Misery loves company and late-night “Facts of Life” marathons.) Jen (Christina Applegate), a tough-as-manicured-nails realtor, has lost her husband, Ted, to a hit-and-run. Judy (Linda Cardellini), a moony painter, is mourning her fiancée.
Probably. Over 10 half hours, which careen from comedy to drama to thriller, the women’s lives and stories take dangerous swerves. So yeah, some spoilers follow. If you haven’t started the series, avert your eyes.
Because finding out, at the end of the first episode, that Judy drove the car that hit Ted? It’s a pretty good surprise.
[Read our review of “Dead to Me.”]
There are other, less lethal surprises, like the show’s frank discussion of women’s health — miscarriage, perimenopause, mastectomy — and its nuanced vision of female friendship.
On a recent afternoon at New York’s Netflix offices, just west of Union Square, the two women posed in tottery heels (Applegate immediately traded hers for a pair of Converse), then subsided into an overstuffed couch to talk grief, camaraderie and career longevity. Toward the interview’s end, series creator Liz Feldman briefly joined in. These are excerpts from the conversation.
Tell me about Jen and Judy.
CHRISTINA APPLEGATE Jen is unlike anyone, but she’s an Everywoman. The world is trying to get her to stop being who she is and stop feeling what she’s feeling and as a result she is incredibly rageful and reactive. She doesn’t know how to smile or laugh or let anyone comfort her. When she meets Judy, it’s life-changing.
LINDA CARDELLINI Judy is a glass half-full person, but life keeps dumping that glass of water over her head.
Why do you think these characters become such close friends?
APPLEGATE Because they allow each other to suffer. I’ve gone through grief in my life. Some people didn’t understand. There’s nothing that holds you down in your grief more than people trying to get you to stop feeling what you’re feeling. Jen and Judy both allow each other to feel what they need to feel. That understanding and that sisterhood is a bond that cannot be broken.
CARDELLINI They’re two people who can totally be themselves with each other. Even though Judy can never truly be herself.
Is this a good friendship? Does it have a darker side?
CARDELLINI Sometimes in a codependent relationship, you enable people to do things that they shouldn’t be doing.
Like taking a golf club to someone’s windshield?
CARDELLINI Or when Jen keys a car and Judy says, “I love you.” That’s warped.
What’s the worst thing a friend has ever done to you?
APPLEGATE I honestly have chosen awesome people. I’m kind of like a “no new friends person” except for my kid’s friends’ parents. And her. [Points to Cardellini.] She’s allowed to come in. But when I was younger, I had a tendency to let people — I wouldn’t even call them friends — come into my life and manipulate me.
CARDELLINI I’m careful with choosing my friends. The only thing I can think of is friends who are gone too soon. It’s not their fault, but I miss them.
Is “Dead to Me” a show about loss, about dealing with it poorly?
APPLEGATE Is there a right way to deal with loss? Society wants you to grieve for like a month, and it’s such [expletive]. I have lost people incredibly close to me suddenly and unexpectedly, and I still think about it. There’s no right or wrong way to do it. You have to honor how you’re feeling.
CARDELLINI Will you repeat the question? I was listening to the answer.
APPLEGATE She asked me what I was wearing, what designers. And then I just decided to talk about loss.
CARDELLINI When you lose somebody, you do the best you can. There are two things in life that you should be able to handle because they’re sort of inevitable: Loss of life and loss of love. And those two things are impossible to know how to deal with no matter how many times they happen to you.
Did you personalize these characters? Christina, did you suggest Jen’s bilateral mastectomy?
APPLEGATE I wanted Jen to have something that made her vulnerable. Making the choice to have a prophylactic mastectomy caused problems in her marriage. So she lives with an insane amount of guilt and shame. Exploring what it’s like to be someone who’s had an amputation, that was the most personal thing that I brought to it.
Linda, what did you bring to Judy?
CARDELLINI There’s a scene at the end of the show where I lose somebody and I say, “I didn’t get to say goodbye.” That was not in the script. But it came out of my mouth. Because I’ve lost people that I didn’t get to say goodbye to. [Starts to cry.] I’m sorry.
And now we’re all going to cry.
CARDELLINI This show, we call it a traumedy, because there’s so much traumatic stuff that happens, and then there’s humor to sort of alleviate that tension and stress.
APPLEGATE Some people have been confused by it. But in life we laugh and we cry and we get surprised by things and we get shocked by things and people are not what they seem. It’s what life feels like — dark and twisty and funny.
Did you know every twist when filming began?
APPLEGATE I knew what was going to happen. It was in Liz’s first pitch to me. And I thought, “That’s just so far-fetched. How do we earn that?” But we earned it!
CARDELLINI On a different show, what you learn at the very end of the first episode could have been an entire season’s arc. With the second season, we know what’s been set up and where it could go.
Have you been picked up for a second season?
CARDELLINI [Gestures toward the Netflix office.] Ask them.
APPLEGATE [Shouting.] Are we getting picked up?
CARDELLINI They’re all ignoring us.
Had you really never met before you were hired?
APPLEGATE Well, I don’t leave my house.
CARDELLINI Yeah, I hardly leave either. We both signed on. Then we had lunch.
APPLEGATE At Crossroads Kitchen, the best vegan restaurant on the planet. We were in love from the get go. People are like, do you guys really like each other? If only they knew!
CARDELLINI We’re really lucky to have finally been able to meet and to work together. [Turning to Applegate.] I mean, you’re a great actress, and a good friend.
Both of you found success pretty early on. Christina, you had “Married with Children.” Linda, you were on “Freaks and Geeks.” Was that a strange way to grow up?
APPLEGATE On “Married,” there was a work ethic: Never take advantage of the people around you, be professional, show up early, know your lines better than anybody. I remember, being really sick and asking a stage manager if she wouldn’t mind getting me an orange juice. She goes, “You have legs.” No one ever treated me special. I think that’s probably why I go through the world not telling my parents that I got nominated for an Emmy.
CARDELLINI Not a lot of people watched my show while it was on the air. We were in the Macy’s Day Parade — we were standing on top of a teapot for no reason — and I remember people flipping us off and yelling, “Who are you?” It’s never happened all at once for me, which afforded me the ability to be a working actress and to earn, which is what I always wanted. I didn’t necessarily want to be famous.
APPLEGATE This is tongue-in-cheek, but someone asked me one time, “What’s the secret to your longevity?” I said, “Mediocre success.”
Hollywood hasn’t always known want to do with actresses once they age out of ingénues. Is this improving?
APPLEGATE [Liz Feldman enters.] Liz Feldman, hi! Oh yeah. I think more and more we’re seeing that. “The Favorite.” Hello! “Big Little Lies.”
LIZ FELDMAN There’s also more acceptance for writing roles for women over 40; there’s actually more of a thirst for it. When I wrote this, nobody said, “Could you make them younger?”
CARDELLINI The over 40 thing? I feel very fortunate that I’ve found this show. It feels better and more well-earned at this age than ever. But I go back and forth. Sometimes I’m strong with it, and sometimes I’m not. It depends.
APPLEGATE Come hang out with me! But yeah, I watched this show and I said to Liz, “Oh my god, I’m 47 and I look … 47.” There are moments of, “When did that happen?”
FELDMAN You’re a pretty damn good 47.
APPLEGATE But you have those days where you feel like, “Aw, damn it.”
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/07/arts/television/dead-to-me-netflix-christina-applegate-linda-cardellini.html
2019-05-07 06:16:03Z
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